Fanatics Inc – Sports Merchandising Dynamics &
Omnichannel Strategy – 29 July 2021
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Specialist:
Title:
Moderator: Nyree Hinton (NH), Third Bridge Sector Analyst
Brian Duffy (BD)
Former Sales Director at Fanatics Inc
Agenda:
1. Sports merchandising consumer trends and supply-demand dynamics
2. Fanatics Inc's e-commerce and retail sales strategy
3. Merger and expansion opportunities
4. H2 2021 demand outlook and role of Amazon in sports merchandising
Contents
Q: Could you provide an overview of the merchandising and memorabilia industry across the various sports?3
Q: How do players such as Fanatics source their products from manufacturers? Are they getting them from
overseas? Are there quality preferences given the types of merchandise? There are many big players such as
Gildan who have large private label businesses and can supply different basics. How do you think Fanatics
and the wider industry thinks about supply sourcing?
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Q: Were there pockets of Fanatics’ merchandise that did very well, despite the coronavirus lockdowns? How
did the company diversify or anticipate supply issues and push products that it knew would still do well
given lower demand for the group as a whole?
5
Q: Could you talk about the licensing dynamic and the risk there? What’s stopping ESPN or the NFL from
cancelling a licence and removing products from their websites? How long is a typical license?
6
Q: What are the dynamics around Fanatics as a D2C company selling sports merchandise vs suppliers, or the
NFL, who maybe have their own way or their own D2C approaches? How can these companies be both
partners and competitors? It seems many companies that have partnered with Fanatics have also invested in
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it.
Q: What is Fanatics’ distribution strategy around its omnichannel mix? How has it been so successful and
grown so fast? Did it just get the right formula?
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Q: Could you comment on Fanatics’ acquisition strategy? The company seems very aggressive in buying
anything that even resembles a similar type of channel or product. How has it been able to expand so much? 8
Q: What are your thoughts on Fanatics’ opportunity in China?
Q: How would you evaluate pricing trends alongside demand for merchandise? Is it very promotional?
Q: Who has the most margin retention or who misses out on opportunity when suppliers have contracts to
pass the product off to retailers at a certain price? Have retailers capitalised on demand by skyrocketing
pricing or are they limited by other controls, such as those from leagues? If they’re not limited by any
controls and do increase pricing by 10-15%, are they likely to lose market share and not be able to sell that
product?
Q: How marketing-heavy is this industry and Fanatics around using digital marketing to get closer to
consumers? How have the competitive barriers to entry changed for Fanatics’ categories, given the rise in
digital over the past two years?
Q: How is Amazon positioned in the sports merchandising industry and how aggressive is it being?
Q: How much switching or channel switching happens between consumers? Is there loyalty for certain
platforms?
Q: What’s your demand outlook over the next year? Is anything commonly overlooked in this market,
whether specific to Fanatics or more general?
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Fanatics Inc – Sports Merchandising Dynamics &
Omnichannel Strategy
Transcription begins at 00:00:01 of the recorded material
NH: Welcome to Third Bridge Forum’s Interview entitled Fanatics Inc – Sports Merchandising Dynamics &
Omnichannel Strategy. I’m Nyree Hinton, and I’ll be facilitating today’s Interview with Mr Brian Duffy, former
Sales Director at Fanatics Inc.
Brian, before we start today’s Interview, please state I agree or I disagree to the following statement: You
understand the definition of material non-public information and agree not to disclose any such information,
or any other information which is confidential, during this Interview.
BD: I agree.
NH: Could you provide an introduction to your background?
BD: Sure, certainly. Hello, everyone. Brian Duffy. Currently working with a company called ’47 Brand in the
sports licensed apparel and headwear business. I’ve spent about 20 years in this industry. Worked with
Reebok in the early days when they took over the on-field licence provider for the NFL. Was with them then as
they struck deals in the NBA. They were then acquired by Adidas, and I worked in several aspects as well, all in
the licensed business, whether it was NBA, NFL, NHL, Major League Soccer, apparel and headwear, dealing
with key customers, key accounts and national retailers. From there, I was with Fanatics for a little over three
years, working with team stadiums as Sales Director overseeing a sales force that worked directly with team
stadiums and concessioneers across all leagues. Now working with, like I said, ’47 Brand, actually overseeing
our business to the Fanatics retail side of things.
[00:02:04]
Q: Could you provide an overview of the merchandising and memorabilia industry across the various sports?
BD: Yes, certainly. I will say right now, we know 2019, excuse me, 2020, rather, was a difficult year for
everyone with all that was going on, with the world shutting down and retailers shutting down. Then when
things started to reopen, I will say it’s been a very strong push in 2021 and traffic is obviously back up to a
certain degree at a lot of places, including stadiums. Ballparks reopened, which has been great. Some of the
foot traffic may not be where it was in the mall, but I think people are going and buying with a purpose. I will
say the industry right now is on fire. You can’t really compare it to 2020 because everything was shut down, so
we’re comparing to 2019 because that’s our best gauge right now. As a whole, I can’t speak for every company
and everyone, but everyone I speak to, business is up vs 2019. Whether it’s up 15%, 20%, even 30%, it’s been
great. The problem that has occurred from it, though, is dealing with getting product. Everyone is clamouring
for everything and anything they can get. People, when I say people, vendors and retailers are running out of
product. They are running out of things that they normally have, carry on a day-to-day basis. Even when it
comes to basic T-shirts, the industry, from what I’m hearing, we’re short and running out of basic tees and
even basic colours.
It’s not unheard of to run out of obscure colours when a certain team in a certain marketplace may get hot. For
example this year, the Phoenix Suns’ business turned to be very great, and to run out of orange tees, okay,
people aren’t necessarily expecting to carry hundreds of thousands of units of inventory in orange, but then we
started seeing residual where people are running out of black T-shirts, grey T-shirts, white T-shirts, which in
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the 20 years of my being in this industry, I’ve never heard of people running out of white T-shirts, and that’s
being vendors and suppliers. That’s the one problem. We’re dealing with issues with delays from factories
because they’re now experiencing more surges and shutdowns. There’s a lack of transportation, boats,
containers. Getting product into the country has definitely been the biggest hurdle. However, the demand is
through the roof. Nobody is shying away. We don’t have product A, people are saying, “What do you have for
product B, C or D?” We need to fill it because demand has been tremendous, and that goes across the board, I
will say, with a lot of the major retailers. Obviously, Fanatics is, in everyone’s eyes in the licensed world, the
biggest retailer. They’re clamouring for anything and everything and can’t keep product on the shelf.
You’re dealing with also the sporting goods or the key accounts, even the mall channels. Again, the traffic in
the mall may not be up, but business is on absolute fire and people cannot keep their shelves full. They’re
running out of product left and right. It’s a good problem to have. Sales have been great. Everyone’s expecting
that the NFL and NCAA business for fall is going to be record-breaking numbers just because last year
stadiums were empty and people were not going into the football games. So they think that this year, just by
watching the trends of how everything is compared vs ’19 and the other leagues, we’re expecting to have
record-breaking numbers for the NFL and NCAA football business this fall. For the memorabilia side, I can’t
completely speak into that as an expert. I know that that landscape is changing drastically. I’m not completely
familiar on how, or understanding how, the NFT and the digital memorabilia work. I know that that
generation, the Gen Z generation, is going towards that and they find a lot of value in that, and I think there
are certain companies who are adjusting and getting behind that.
You’re seeing athletes wanting to take more ownership because people are making a lot of money off their
likeness and selling an autographed Tom Brady helmet or jersey, or whatever player it may be. That business
has been very strong. It’s based on historical and retro memorabilia, but I think now, younger generations
aren’t necessarily looking for the players that they don’t know, but they want the current players that they do
know. That world is changing, and it’s going into, like everything else, digital. It’s definitely been huge, from
what I’m hearing. During the pandemic, baseball card collecting was at an all-time high that it’s been for
probably I think 5-10 years. I know Topps Trading Cards business has been trending very strong. I think it’s an
industry that’s definitely coming back. There’s new consumer involvement again. They’re doing it in a different
way, which I haven’t really dealt with and I don’t know the whole ins and outs, but it sounds like it’s definitely
a way of the future, and it’s not going away.
[00:08:17]
Q: How do players such as Fanatics source their products from manufacturers? Are they getting them from
overseas? Are there quality preferences given the types of merchandise? There are many big players such as
Gildan who have large private label businesses and can supply different basics. How do you think Fanatics and
the wider industry thinks about supply sourcing?
BD: You have two different channels where you can supply product. Overseas, which is where the majority of
your business comes from, and then domestic. Domestic is generally printing capabilities, printing T-shirts
and fleece, and finishing some domestic hats that you’ll have on shelf. The domestic side is generally used
when… again, no one can foresee who’s going to be the best team. Last year, no one expected the Buffalo Bills
to be the team that they were, and to be as strong a business as it was. So going into that season, retailers
would not have booked as heavily on Bills. Even Tampa Bay Buccaneers, even though they’ve got Tom Brady,
the booking cycle is so many months far in advance, and I’ll talk into that in a second, so you have to really
take advantage of your domestic capabilities in printing, working with whether you own screen printers or
working with third-party screen printers, which a lot of people do as well, and getting product into the market
place in a much quicker manner. Whether that means it’s getting it in 48 hours or getting in in two weeks, it’s
still considered to be a quick turn, and there’s a lot of business in that.
It’s only planned partially. You can plan to have certain blanks and things like that, but again, you don’t know
which markets are going to take off and are going to be the ones driving the business. So when those things
occur, you have to able to react as well as you can and get as much product into those market places as you
can, because like I said, like the Buffalo Bills and the Bills Mafia, you couldn’t get enough Bills product into the
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market place. Even last year during the pandemic and not as many retailers being open, there was a huge
demand for it. We’re not sure which team that’ll be this year, but everyone ramps up their domestic
capabilities for that. On the overseas side of things, you’re looking at booking out nine months in advance,
sometimes even longer, depending on the product. I think jerseys, which are always a top-selling item, it’s a
high-priced item, and it’s been great that we’ve seen a resurgence in the jersey business. Again, players can get
traded, things of that nature. I think a company like Fanatics, where they are manufacturing jerseys on the
MLB side, Nike-branded, NFL side, Nike-branded, and then they have a licence to do their own NHL and NBA
jersey, may not necessarily be the authentics or the higher-end jersey, but they’re ramping up their inventories
where they can embellish domestically. It’s not the same as, some frills are taken out of it from what the
jerseys are from overseas. So they take inventory stances on that as well.
Just even looking back a couple of years, when Steph Curry on the Warriors blew up and no one expected him
to become as big as he was. It’s not as if we had an endless supply at the time. Now you try to plan for which
players there are, but every year there’s going to be, whether it’s a trade or a player that comes out of nowhere,
and again, you’re not going to necessarily have the finished product to come in, because you’re buying 6-9
months out in advance, and then all of the product, so right now all the major vendors just had their order
deadlines for spring ’22 baseball, so product will deliver in February and March for start of season of baseball.
The order deadlines were between, I think, seven one and eight one for most of the major vendors, and that
product is then sourced overseas. There’s obviously a lot of compliance, working with the leagues and
approval. I know Nike, who obviously is the official supplier for MLB, NFL, NBA, and Adidas doing the NHL
jersey and Major League Soccer jersey, that there are certain guidelines that they have to abide by with
compliance on factories and human rights.
There are constantly tests and backgrounds going on involving that. I don’t work on the sourcing side so I can’t
go into the details of how they do it, but I do know there are a lot of strict parameters in place, especially
working with the leagues because everyone wants to make sure that what they’re doing is compliant to all the
human rights. There are constantly checks going on, and changing of factories. When you’re dealing with a
company like Nike, they’re not just making jerseys. They’re making footwear and all kinds of apparel, so their
deals with factories, they’re pretty strict, and the same with a company like Adidas. Then when you deal with
smaller vendors like a ’47 Brand or a Mitchell & Ness, we’ve been using factories that we’ve had partnerships
with the past 15-20 years and working with them. The only thing is, right now, again, dealing with situations
where they’re starting to deal with surges and spikes and coronavirus cases again. We’re dealing with certain
shutdowns. We’re trying to plan in advance, and now there’s obviously a concern of, will it affect us in having
delays, because of everything that’s going on in the world? There are obviously, like I said, very strict
guidelines in working with those factories.
[00:14:57]
Q: Were there pockets of Fanatics’ merchandise that did very well, despite the coronavirus lockdowns? How
did the company diversify or anticipate supply issues and push products that it knew would still do well given
lower demand for the group as a whole?
BD: I think a lot of it could possibly also be because companies do take inventory stances, and because the
way ’19 worked, most vendors, we took orders for retailers and brought product in, and they didn’t force
retailers to take product because they were closed, and so, to work with them in partnerships, said, “Okay we’ll
hold it,” in certain agreements and taking it in a certain timeline. I think that was a stopgap where, across all
different types of product, we were able to fill the pipeline because there was, again, in 2020 where there was
no product being brought in from anyone, so all that product, vendors had, so there wasn’t a shortage right
away. Then the shortage came. Basically, we were a year behind. In 2021, start of the year, we were selling the
2020 product, getting that into retailers. Everyone sold through everything, and then we’re looking for what
we had for the 2021 lines, and that’s where the delays occurred. Again, I think the demand went to wherever
you had product. I know headwear, for a fact, has done extremely well. Fitted headwear, like the New Era
business. People were concerned, was their company going to make it through all of this, because of some of
the deals they had in place and some of the inventory stances, but now they can’t get enough of it and the
inventory has blown out. They’ve done a pretty good job of getting stuff in, and now is when we’re actually
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starting to see the run out of inventory again.
It’s a little unknown as to how everyone will handle the next few months, and getting through until we’re back
in better shape, inventory position-wise, but there really hasn’t been a dip in demand for any particular type of
product. Again, I will say, the things that have definitely driven it were jerseys, fitted headwear. Actually, I
know the short business has been at a better position than it’s ever been in before. Mitchell & Ness has had a
great success with a lot of their short business. Even the retro jerseys because, again, some of those things they
can take positions on, because a retired player, you don’t have to worry about him getting traded, so there’s
always going to be a demand for that. I think they’re filling a lot of that void. Part of that also could be with
Nike’s distribution strategy, where Nike is selling to less and less retailers, which means those retailers still
want to stay in business and they’re still trying to do… NBA. for example, they’re trying to stay relevant, sell
NBA jerseys. Maybe they can’t get a LeBron James or a Steph Curry jersey, but they can get a retired player,
whether it’s Kobe Bryant or Magic Johnson or things of those nature. Those have started to trend well back
again, and I think maybe because those retailers are putting that product out there, so they’ve been doing very
well.
[00:18:43]
Q: Could you talk about the licensing dynamic and the risk there? What’s stopping ESPN or the NFL from
cancelling a licence and removing products from their websites? How long is a typical license?
BD: I think it’s changed drastically over the past 10 years, where, again, I was with Reebok and Adidas, and
we had long-term deals with all the major league sports. I think as Nike started to get more and more in the
professional sports licensed world, and then Fanatics running a lot of licences themselves, they’ve struck deals
with leagues, so at the end of the day, the cost of the licences has gone up drastically. There are minimum
guarantees which scare people away. They’ll scare away some of the smaller companies and the smaller
vendors. It’s changed drastically, whether it’s for the better or for the worse. The leagues are obviously making
a lot more money, so they’re not too upset with these deals, obviously, because at the end of the day, their
bottom line is going up, and it’s because of the minimum guarantees that they are requiring now, and so
there’s less and less people making product. When you look at who really runs the licence world now, it’s
companies like Nike and Fanatics, and then you have a couple of smaller vendors like, like I said, ’47 Brand
and Mitchell & Ness and Outerstuff, which does kidswear, and a handful of other companies, Zeffer and
obviously New Era. The deals that Nike has struck has locked them up for long term. The best licences to have
are the actual on-field and on-court providers because that’s where you get the most recognition, and those are
the products that the players wear and those are the product that fans want to buy the most because they see it
being worn by the players in the games.
Fanatics has done a brilliant job with their deals with the leagues, where they’re controlling certain licences. I
believe they control the Major League Soccer licence. They control the NFL PA licence. They have a licence to
manufacture product in all the major league sports as well, so they can go vertical, and it allows them make
product. They’re paying a minimum guarantee to the league, which some people, it scares them because then
they have to price their product at such a higher premium in order to make the margins they need to, but with
Fanatics having their outlets of selling online themselves, they make the product, they’re paying the royalties
to the league at full boat, but they’re still making their full margin because they’re selling it themselves. They’re
selling direct to consumer. Like I said, Nike has cut out a lot of retailers. They’re selling more and more direct
to consumer. Everyone who has a major licence now is selling it to the key retailers and less and less with some
of the smaller ones. They still are doing business with them, but you’re doing more with less. When you look at
it, those are the guys who run the licence business. It’s every deal that is struck with Fanatics and a league, and
the licence people scratch their heads and they can’t believe it.
Obviously, he’s going in with some of these deals he’s cut but he can control where licence business is going to
a degree. The leagues obviously have a lot of say in it and, legally, there has to be compliance and not
monopolising anything, but I think they’re working smarter and they’re doing more business with less than
that what everyone had to deal with in the past. In this business, your licence is everything. You have a licence
in the key sports, that’s where your business is going to be, and if you’re not, you’ll miss out on it. You’ll have
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some guys who will have quick runs here and there but these deals are long-term. Like I said, Nike and
Fanatics, they’re not cutting the three year licence deals. They’re cutting the 10- to 15-year licence deals, which
I’m sure every few years are up for an audit or a re-negotiation to a certain degree, but they’re working very
much in the favour of everyone, the league, the company and the fan and everyone who can get the product.
[00:23:57]
Q: What are the dynamics around Fanatics as a D2C company selling sports merchandise vs suppliers, or the
NFL, who maybe have their own way or their own D2C approaches? How can these companies be both
partners and competitors? It seems many companies that have partnered with Fanatics have also invested in
it.
BD: If I could understand it completely, I would. I don’t think anyone outside of the immediate people cutting
the deals can fully understand them. They’re definitely perplexing. Fanatics is basically two entities. They’re a
retailer which runs the websites and the e-commerce for all the major league sports. They run them for several
teams. They run bricks-and-mortar for several teams. They run events, so their retail landscape is pretty wide.
They’re dabbling across the board in every place you can imagine. Then their manufacturing side, which they
call the Fanatics brand, which, again, is making their own product, but also in that deal is the licence business
where they have struck with Nike on the NFL and Major League Baseball side of things, where Nike is
obviously very much involved in how the product is made, where it’s made, etc, but Fanatics really has control
on running that business for Nike. That allows Fanatics, again, to sell into their channels and also sell into
other retailers. That’s where it’s funny. Everyone is a competitor of Fanatics, but also everyone is a partner of
Fanatics. All the major vendors are selling into Fanatics retail, but then they’re competing with the Fanatics
manufacturing branded side. Then retailers are competing against Fanatics retail, but then they’re also
partnered up because they’re buying from the Fanatics manufacturing side.
It’s a very complicated business in how they’ve structured everything. I’m sure there are a lot of people who
have a love-hate relationship with them. At the end of the day, you realise if you’re going to be in this industry,
you have to learn how to play nice and work together, because you’re not going to bite off your nose to spite
your face and say, “We’re not going to work with them or deal with them,” because they are going to be around
for a long time, and they’re running channels that you need to be partnered up with them, so everyone’s
finding ways to work with them, whether they like it or not. They’re making it work. It’s definitely a crazy set-
up across the board for every aspect, with vendors, retailers, every channel imaginable. There’s, I don’t want to
say a conflict, but there’s definitely friendly competition across the board, while still partnering up and doing
business with them as well.
[00:27:40]
Q: What is Fanatics’ distribution strategy around its omnichannel mix? How has it been so successful and
grown so fast? Did it just get the right formula?
BD: Their distribution is two-fold, whether it’s manufacturing and selling it to retailers who need the product
because, again, their deals are striking with Nike and the leagues, so they’re creating product that these
retailers definitely need and want, and then the omnichannel where, again, I’m sure that is definitely their
driver in business for the company as a whole because of the deals, the way they’re structured. They own it
from making the product all the way to selling it to the end user and the fan. The amount of people nowadays,
especially this past year, who didn’t want to go shopping to a store, end up buying it online. If you’re watching
a game, you’re absolutely going to see advertisements to go to NBAstore.com or NHL store, NFL shop, and
those are run by Fanatics, and so they’re going to carry product from other vendors on there, but they’re also
carrying their own product in there and I’m sure that’s front and foremost in front of everyone’s eyes.
Some of the product, if it’s the product that’s dealing with those on-field licences or on-court licences, those
are absolutely what the fans are looking for. They’re creating everything where they can have the official,
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authentic product but then their ability to make fanwear or lifestyle product as well so they can offer
everything, whether it’s stuff that they’re making or, again, they are buying from other vendors as well, so they
carry all that on their websites and on their retailers. It is a true omnichannel. They’re doing everything,
whether it’s through themselves or bringing in from other places as well just to make sure that they do have
every option and they’re going to be the go-to player, if you’re going to shop online or if you’re going to buy
something, that people now know that this is the key place, and I think that’s one of their main ideas. Other
key retailers are never going to go away, they’re going to continue to be in this business and do well across the
board, but I think as time has grown, more and more people definitely realise that the place to go to get
product has been Fanatics and going to the team websites. You may not know it off the top of your head that
it’s Fanatics-run, but you’re watching an NFL game, so you want to go to the NFL store, or you’re on NFL.com
and you want to go to the store to buy product and it sure as heck, there it is. It’s run by Fanatics, it’s a
Fanatics experience.
[00:31:17]
Q: Could you comment on Fanatics’ acquisition strategy? The company seems very aggressive in buying
anything that even resembles a similar type of channel or product. How has it been able to expand so much?
BD: I think a lot of it has been some of their major acquisitions in the past few years, acquired a memorabilia
company that was first in class and that has helped them, but then also when they acquired Majestic, which
was the on-field supplier in baseball, it gave them a couple of things where it gave them the licensed business
for baseball and then from there they struck up additional deals to expand that business and brought Nike into
the loop, which everyone, including the league, obviously was pretty excited to have Nike as an on-field
supplier and Fanatics now running that. Also with that acquisition it gave them some infrastructure, and it
was their first big purchase. They previously had been producing and manufacturing Fanatics-branded
product, but now they had a true licensed apparel company that had been in the business, in the industry for
several years, manufacturing and selling product. They had that infrastructure of the buildings, the factories
and the sales force and everything to deal with the retailers. Then throughout the ways, I think one of the more
recent ones was Top of the World, which, headwear and apparel and they’re big. Again, getting that gave them
some licences in the NCAA space that they may not have already had.
Also, it’s selling into a channel where Top of the World was first in class in selling into a lot of the mass
market, like a Walmart and a Target, and it allowed them to really get after that business. Also, Fanatics, what
they had been doing for a few years very well on the manufacturing side was apparel. They had been doing
headwear, but headwear is a completely separate animal, a different animal from apparel. They then had a,
quote, unquote, headwear company to get after and grow their headwear business. I don’t know what they’re
doing with it now, if they’re using that for other leagues or if it’s been strictly Top of the World headwear,
NCAA-focused, but it allows them to expand and grow their headwear footprint across the board, allowing
them, again, logistics. Every acquisition they make, absolutely the rights have to play a big part of it. They
already have the rights on something, it doesn’t probably make a ton of sense for them to acquire companies if
they can already do something on their own, but if it gives them the rights that they don’t already have, it
expands their portfolio, who they’re selling into and only increases their capabilities of doing and making what
they’re already doing and expanding it across their brand.
[00:34:48]
Q: What are your thoughts on Fanatics’ opportunity in China?
BD: Yes, I’m not 100% sure. This is, I guess, speculation for how they’re doing everything overseas. Again,
overseas expansion is big for everyone right now and, again, a lot of it has to do with the rights in the sports
that you have. I don’t think necessarily the NFL is a huge play in China, but we know the NBA business has
been growing tremendously over in China and Asia, so I think it’s definitely a major focus, plus they’re dealing
with some of the premier soccer leagues. I don’t know exactly who they have licensed over there, but we know
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that that’s more of a global sport that is doing well overseas, so not just China but in Asia, Europe. It gives
them more expansion there. They had acquired an e-comm company a handful of years ago called Kitbag,
that’s again more Europe but they got them into that European marketplace. I don’t know exactly the
immediate plans of growing and getting bigger in China. I know it’s absolutely a focus, as it is a focus with
everyone because the upside in China. In China it seems like there’s a lot of play in the fashion world. Again, it
all depends on the popularity of the sport and how they can utilise that to grow their business over there.
Again, I don’t know actual plans and how they’re doing it, but they’re going to take advantage of using, like I
said, their licences in all the major league sports they have. I know basketball is one of the more popular US
sports over in China, so that’s probably going to be where they look to expand or at least capture some of the
fanbase, and then depending if there are other sports and the gaming sports and the e-sports. As those are
growing, they are cutting deals in those leagues as well. If there’s a fanbase anywhere in the world, they’re
going to explore being a licensee in that business. It’s not just the four or five major sports in the United
States. If it’s in this region and there’s demand, they’ll say, “What’s the sport? How do we partner up with
them, whether it’s get a licence or be a vendor for them?” and they’re going to explore every one of those
options.
[00:37:46]
Q: How would you evaluate pricing trends alongside demand for merchandise? Is it very promotional?
BD: Prices are pretty fixed by a company. It’s not like everyone fluctuates their prices throughout the year.
You’re selling in a jersey or a hat at your wholesale price. You’re going to hold that price throughout your deal
because you’re signing deals with the leagues, but with your retailers and your partners, so it’s a difficult story
to say, “I’m going to increase my prices on a whim.” Obviously, costs are going through the roof. It’s
announced when price increases are occurring, at least dealing with retailers, and the end user will see it as
well, but prices are absolutely going up across the board because costs are going up across the board, and
that’s not just this industry. Every industry people are seeing prices are going up, and it’s again because of lack
of supply and all the hurdles and obstacles and costs that everyone is acquiring now, so it has to translate and
be passed on. Everyone’s going to have to incur some of the costs, whether it’s the suppliers, the vendors, the
factories, the vendors, the retailers and the fans, everyone. Prices are going to go up on everything across the
board.
Margins, unfortunately, probably have taken a little bit of a hit this past year just because of chasing product
and getting product in is costing more and you can’t necessarily just pass that cost on immediately. Because of
that, that’s where they’re going to change and say, “Okay, in the future, an item that may have wholesaled at
USD 14, a T-shirt that we may have been wholesaling at USD 14 is now going up to USD 15 or USD 16, and a
hat that may have been USD 14 is now going up to USD 15.” All the different levels of product, the costs are
going to increase because they have margin structures that everyone has to work off of. Is there a short term
hit in margins for people? Absolutely, but that means that they’re going to have to figure out a way to either
cut costs or increase prices to continue to keep those margins because no one is going to continue to make less
of a margin. They can’t. They have to operate and there’s a certain margin. Companies, like everyone we’ve
mentioned before, like a Fanatics or any of the major league sports, everyone’s got a finance team who’s
watching every cost and saying, “Okay, this is your target margin and if you can’t hit it on an item, move on
and find an item that you can hit the margin on.” Maybe that changes the landscape of some of the product
you’re making, and you may be smarter with what you have to offer, but no one’s going to say, “Okay, our
margin was X this year, and it’s now less than that, we’re going to be fine going forward with less than that.”
They’re going to find ways to get back up to the margin that they need to be at to operate.
[00:41:32]
Q: Who has the most margin retention or who misses out on opportunity when suppliers have contracts to
pass the product off to retailers at a certain price? Have retailers capitalised on demand by skyrocketing
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pricing or are they limited by other controls, such as those from leagues? If they’re not limited by any controls
and do increase pricing by 10-15%, are they likely to lose market share and not be able to sell that product?
BD: Legally, people I don’t think can dictate. You have to be careful when you talk pricing because no one can
dictate or tell a retailer what they have to sell something at. We have suggested retail, but, legally, the retailer
has the rights to sell the product at what they’re going to sell it at. Sure, if costs have gone up, do they want to
pass the opportunity (ph 42.57) on? I don’t think people, just because demand has gone up, are saying, “We’re
going to rake the end user over the coals and increase our price.” I think they’re more so, “Demand is going up,
let’s use it to get people in and buy more product.” Because once you start pricing certain items at a certain
premium, it’s going to be out of reach. The consumer is going to say, “I’m used to paying USD 30 for this T-
shirt. I’m not going to pay USD 50 for it,” or a jersey, if I’m paying USD 110 for an NBA jersey or USD 120,
whatever, I’m not just going to pay USD 150 for it. The consumer will spend his or her dollars on something
different. I don’t think people are just increasing prices to take advantage of the demand. I think the demand
has been great and it’s more of using the demand. If we run out of something, we’ll sell a lot of what we have,
which is always a good problem, and then push people into buying the other product we have, but I don’t think
people are using that as a platform to just increase prices to increase revenue. You realise that you get to a
certain point, the customer is just going to say, “I’m not spending that for that.”
[00:44:23]
Q: How marketing-heavy is this industry and Fanatics around using digital marketing to get closer to
consumers? How have the competitive barriers to entry changed for Fanatics’ categories, given the rise in
digital over the past two years?
BD: I think a couple of different ways you market. First and foremost, the deals that they’re striking with the
leagues in putting product in front of people, the best marketing deal you can have is having your brand on the
product that the players are wearing because that’s what people are watching and they’re seeing that, right?
Nike has a great presence, obviously, on that where you’re watching an NFL, MLB, NBA game, the Nike
swoosh is prominent everywhere and people see it, and it’s funny because it’s probably not necessarily
considered marketing in a lot of people’s eyes, but I guarantee you to that brand it absolutely is. They’re
marketing their brand by having any and every player… whether you look at it or not, James Harden is an
Adidas athlete, but he’s also a Nike athlete because he’s wearing a Nike jersey. He may not be under a Nike
contract, but the way it’s viewed is, “Okay, he’s wearing Nike out here,” because he’s wearing a Nike jersey.
Obviously, his footwear may be Adidas. Those to me may not be called out as a marketing expense, but it
absolutely is marketing your brand that way.
Fanatics as a whole has done a great job with marketing through their partnerships with all the leagues and
they’re adapting to the world as we know it where a handful of years ago people wouldn’t even consider buying
things online. They had to walk into a store. Fanatics was the big presence of buying online. Now people aren’t
necessarily going to a website to buy product, they’re buying it on their phone but not necessarily going to a
website. They’re buying it through their social media and how they see things and where it’s convenient. I
think a company like Fanatics, as well as several others, they’re very strategic in marketing, whether it’s their
brand or marketing their product and selling their product directly to consumers in every place you can.
You’re walking down the street and you see someone wearing a hat or see someone wearing a jersey and say,
“Yes, I want that,” and you can buy it straight from your phone, obviously. I think they’re being pretty strategic
on how they work with social media and probably even social influencers and capturing the audience and the
end user and the retailer, so I think it’s absolutely a focus of theirs. I don’t know how big of a team they have,
but I know it’s not like it’s just something that they throw someone who’s an intern at it and say, “How do you
focus?” They definitely have a team of people focusing on reaching out to that generation that’s not necessarily
traditional. You’ll see the banners at major league parks and stadiums and you’ll see the commercials on TV
but it’s absolutely a huge focus on getting in front of people who are just staring at their phone all day.
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[00:48:04]
Q: How is Amazon positioned in the sports merchandising industry and how aggressive is it being?
BD: I don’t think they are being as aggressive… Amazon sells everything, right? You can buy anything you
want on Amazon, where a company like Fanatics has been focused on sports apparel, sports licensed apparel
and headwear, and so they’re obviously a lot more aggressive. You have a lot of third-party sellers on Amazon.
A way a lot of deals are structured, if you’re working with Fanatics, they want to be your main supplier for
online business, so certain deals may be struck where and when you can sell or how you sell your product.
Fanatics, they own the e-commerce space. Amazon, if you even go on it, it will probably be very difficult to find
the assortment of licensed product that you find on a Fanatics or a major retailer’s own website as well. With
that being said, people realise more and more people are buying everything on Amazon. It’s a loyal customer. I
don’t know what the immediate plans are between Fanatics and Amazon, but I’m sure there have been
discussions and I would not be surprised if Fanatics is looking to partner up in a certain way where they can
use the platform of Amazon to get in front of those consumers and strike a deal. Fanatics has been great at
striking deals with retailers and saying, “We’re an expert in this part of the business, let us work together and
run that. You may look at us as a competitor because we’re a retailer, but how do we run this business for
you?” I would be shocked if you don’t see something coming down the pipeline, I don’t know the time frame,
but where they strike a deal and they’re running some sort of business on Amazon.
[00:50:35]
Q: How much switching or channel switching happens between consumers? Is there loyalty for certain
platforms?
BD: I’m sure there’s a certain loyalty among certain consumers, but I think the way the world is changing, I
think consumers will go with where they can get the product. I don’t know what the percentage of the loyalty is
where someone says, “I always buy my product at this retailer,” or “I always buy my hats from a Lids.” People
view certain retailers as an expert in certain categories and certain product, and I will say Fanatics is probably
one that is now viewed as an expert in the sports licensed world, but I think people are a lot more savvy these
days with shopping and trying to find the item at the price they want, and there are many other places you can
look. Instead of shopping store to store and driving store to store, you can look online and say, “Dick’s
Sporting Goods has something at this price,” or, “Fanatics has something at this price” or an Academy or
whoever, Kohl’s or Penney’s or whoever it may be. I think there is probably less and less loyalty just because of
the more accessibility to get the product, but I would say that Fanatics is doing a great job with partnering with
retailers and working together to say, “Let us be your expert in this space and we’ll work together.” At the end
of the day, the consumer in one way or another may be funnelled into doing business or buying from Fanatics
even though they may be looking on a different area or different platform. Because of the partnerships that
Fanatics is cutting and doing, at the end of the day, they own more of the retail real estate.
[00:52:58]
Q: What’s your demand outlook over the next year? Is anything commonly overlooked in this market, whether
specific to Fanatics or more general?
BD: Demand is going to continue, I think, unfortunately, a lot of things could play out depending on what
happens in the world, if we have shutdowns and games stop. In the licensed world, if games aren’t playing,
you’re going to see business drop, but if we’re optimistic, there’ll be games. I think demand, we’re on for a
record-breaking year when it comes to NFL and NCAA. I think fans are excited to get back to watching sports.
They’re hungry, they want product. Just the way trend has been for ’21, you’re going to see a great year and
demand be extremely high. When it comes to overlooking, our industry, it’s not like there’s a new item that can
just come out of the blue and people create. There are always small, little quirky trends or products that people
hadn’t thought of, like, “Let’s do this and create this.”
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I think a company like Fanatics, and we didn’t touch upon it, but during the acquisition, I think their next big
look is “Okay, how do we expand outside of the merchandise landscape? We’re doing a great job with selling
jerseys and hats and the demand is there and that’s what people want,” and their focus is, “Okay, how do we
continue to grow that? But you can only grow that by so much. So where is our business going? Where else can
we go?” I’m sure if you’re reading up on them, they’ve hired a couple of pretty high-profile people in the last
few months that have pretty diversified backgrounds outside of what Fanatics is used to doing, being the
merchandisers. At the end of the day, Fanatics is a merchandise company, but they’re also a tech company and
I think you’re going to see more and more of their expansion outside of just the merchandise realm where
they’re looking at, whether it’s gaming, something else on the digital platforms or different things. Like I’ve
said, they’ve hired some pretty prominent people who are going to expand that company outside of just the
normal world that everyone’s been accustomed to seeing from them over the past several years.
[00:55:30]
NH: Awesome. Thank you Brian. We will now end the Interview. Let me just close by saying thank you for
your time today. We covered a lot. Thank you, clients, for joining Third Bridge Forum’s Interview today. Have
a good one. If you would like to arrange a private meeting or consultation, please contact your relationship
managers.
BD: Excellent. Thank you, Nyree.
NH: Yes, take it easy.
Transcription ends at 00:55:44 of the recorded material
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